Pay to Play

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Silverphish
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Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2016 7:48 pm

Pay to Play

Postby Silverphish » Sun Dec 25, 2016 4:46 pm

Just a word here about my thoughts on payment models.

I believe in paying for the things that I like. Our money is our method of maintaining the things we want to see exist in the world when we don't have the skills or other resources to create it ourselves. I never really understood why CoH went down like the Lusitania without trying to be more creative with funding. If they had said they needed to double their subscription price to maintain the service, I would have paid it. I sincerely hope that the SoH team sorts out what is financially necessary for the company to stay healthy, and devise a payment method that will keep them there. I will pay it. I think a monthly subscription price is a good stable way to have steady income, and I don't mind in-game micro-payments as long as they are just for cosmetic things.

I don't mind the idea of free to play for giving a taste, but I think it should be very limited. For example, free usernames have some common suffix, and free accounts are limited to a few levels of play (maybe 5), ooo... and make them vulnerable to the knockback effects of paying players (haha, maybe not). I just don't like the idea of full access to the entire game for free for the sake of body count. This is where most of your trolls come from, because they really have nothing invested. They just don't care about the game.

I also think that this title will attract a lot of older gamers who understand and appreciate the idea that it's necessary to outlay for the things you want in life.

Thoughts?

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Styrj
Posts: 96
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2016 7:48 pm
Location: Dora, AL, USA 35062

Re: Pay to Play

Postby Styrj » Sun Dec 25, 2016 4:46 pm

Agreed! Just to add to what Silverphish said, maybe 3 Toon slots for FTP and go from there.
:D If it ain't broke, don't fix it! :D

minifig404
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2016 7:48 pm

Re: Pay to Play

Postby minifig404 » Sun Dec 25, 2016 4:46 pm

Assume for a moment that SoH requires a monthly subscription, with no free tier.

A person plays for a couple hours per day, seven days a week, for multiple years. They get to max level, and finish most of the in-game content, and write up several posts that help other people get through the game easier, and keep playing. Then, said person gets into a car crash, and becomes permanently disabled. They lose their job, and are likely unable to get a new one, because of their particular disability. But, through some clever tricks and the help of some generous real-life friends, they can continue to play their video games.

Would you, the other subscribers of the game, want to lose that player?

Would you, the game developers, want to setup a business model that forces people out because they shouldn't pay every month any longer?

Does a limited free tier for the first five levels really change anything with regards to people being unable to pay the subscription anymore?

Lazarus
Posts: 78
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2016 7:48 pm

Re: Pay to Play

Postby Lazarus » Sun Dec 25, 2016 4:46 pm

Are we speaking of area zones or experience levels? Because while giving a taste is fine, I wouldn't want a free player to have access to more than one zone - too much content for free.

Maybe some sort of system could be implemented for earning and storing free months? Maybe for helping the community or playing a lot of hours?

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Golden Stone
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Location: Severn, Maryland

Re: Pay to Play

Postby Golden Stone » Sun Dec 25, 2016 4:47 pm

I have to agree with Lazarus here. I believe that it would be harmful to subscribers if free toons were given the run of the place. A certain percentage of those free toons are inevitably going to be griefers or in game currency merchants. It may be challenging, but finding a good balance between free and paid access will be much needed. Something to perhaps consider would be to lock free toons out of any global chat that may be in game, perhaps going so far as to grant an item on subscription; a comm of some sort? This would still allow local speaking range chat for running missions, asking questions, and experiencing the environment.. as well as perhaps a chat channel specifically to help new players without ending up with global spam. The buying of items that grant game time could still be accessed in a marketplace.

The availability of game time in the economy would be a really cool add, imho. It worked really well in one space based economy i know of... where someone had to actually buy the game time in order to place it on the market. This allows for folks who are dedicated players strapped for cash to be able to play and keep the economy moving forward. At the same time it allows for folks who play casually to catch up by purchasing time and placing it on the market. Might it work here?

minifig404
Posts: 5
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2016 7:48 pm

Re: Pay to Play

Postby minifig404 » Sun Dec 25, 2016 4:47 pm

I have to agree with Lazarus here. I believe that it would be harmful to subscribers if free toons were given the run of the place. A certain percentage of those free toons are inevitably going to be griefers or in game currency merchants. It may be challenging, but finding a good balance between free and paid access will be much needed.
Game developers put in a lot of hard work with very little guarantee it'll pay off. I'm not going to try to tell them they can't put a price tag on their game, be it a one-time fee or a monthly subscription. I just think that some ways of charging for content have different side effects than others. However the devs want to setup their pricing structure and handle side effects is fine by me.

Some method to gift/trade/sell game time is an interesting idea given an otherwise hard subscription requirement. I won't pursue the particulars of that idea yet.

DaveC
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Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2016 7:48 pm

Re: Pay to Play

Postby DaveC » Sun Dec 25, 2016 4:47 pm

First time posting, but I am a big believer in paying for what you get. If the game isn't supported it won't last. All the hard work of getting a game up and running needs to be rewarded not only to pay for the game but to have a little profit for those that worked so hard to make it happen.

zapped
Posts: 13
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2016 7:48 pm

Re: Pay to Play

Postby zapped » Sun Dec 25, 2016 4:47 pm

I agree with what was is being said here in regards to subscriptions and F2P. In my opinion F2P is whats killing gaming now. There is no loyalty amongst F2Pers.They jump from one game to the next, always seeking the next latest and greatest. And lets be honest here, 50 cents a day is dirt cheap when you consider how much entertainment value you get for your money. Its $12.50 or more for a movie in most areas of the country and that only lasts a couple of hours.

As the OP said, I would be willing to pay MORE than 15 dollars a month for a game that was good. Maybe a platinum subscription tier?

What I dont want is a ton of micro-transactions I have to pay for in order to stay competitive

AxerJ
Posts: 166
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2016 7:48 pm

Re: Pay to Play

Postby AxerJ » Sun Dec 25, 2016 4:48 pm

Agreed with most - $15 or so per month is fine and probably generates a healthier playing community. Please avoid any necessary micro-payments in game - anything on top of the monthly charge should be purely cosmetic (and please don't go too nuts with those options either =P)

DLK
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Dec 22, 2016 7:48 pm

Re: Pay to Play

Postby DLK » Sun Dec 25, 2016 4:48 pm

The final for COH/COV it's was a FTP and for this type of games it's the death !

Smidgen0luv
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Jan 13, 2017 12:16 pm

Re: Pay to Play

Postby Smidgen0luv » Fri Jan 13, 2017 1:14 pm

I agree, games with monthly subs tend to have a healthier community attitude. Ya still get those folks from time to time that take the monthly sub as a right to entitlement, but the core community will keep things grounded. I kinda liked the way CO did it, but I was never F2P there so yeah there's that.

I like the idea of restricting chat in some ways for F2P to avoid added trolling/spam, but I'm kinda on the fence about this one as many of the friends I had in CO were F2P. Definitely limit their ability to post rapidly in global channels like a time limit between posts. Allowing one to say ask a question in chat to get the attention of a helpful player without being able to spam. I've always been a fan of ye old ignore system. The Ignore system should be in from the start, automatically remove ignored players if the account is closed (looking at you goldsellers), and have a healthy limit of 100+. Some more recent popular MMOs neglected this feature at launch and it caused A LOT of angst in the community. Save yourself and your playerbase the trouble from the jump.

I'm all for a token type system that we could trade/sell. Being able to sell them allows players who don't have as much time to play, or those with some extra cash, to progress. Sometimes folks hit a rough patch, and I think being able to help a friend out with their sub also helps foster community well-being and a sense of teamwork for supergroups. Just please don't post names in the Auction/Market, that way if someone in a group is looking for help, but there's a player present that wishes to sell a token and isn't interested in helping they don't have to suffer some sort of drama. Yes I like to cover all bases :lol:

SonnyCorle
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2017 5:24 am

Re: Pay to Play

Postby SonnyCorle » Sat Jan 28, 2017 5:34 am

I honestly prefer a buy to play model. Maybe with an in game cash shop. I think Guild Wars 2 & ESO are on the right path. Personally I don't mind paying a monthly subscription fee as long as updates and content are frequently added.

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JestersGhost
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Joined: Sun Dec 25, 2016 4:39 pm

Re: Pay to Play

Postby JestersGhost » Sat Jan 28, 2017 5:42 am

Add another vote to the subscription pile.

I paid for two subscriptions to CoH right up until it went F2P (and then only one - the second account was for demoing the game to friends, and the occasional enhancement transfer before base storage).

I've actually stopped playing games currently - I basically only played LoL before I stopped, but I decided I could be more constructive with my time. If SoH turns out be as good as it's looking so far, however, I'll be dusting off the old gaming PC for sure, and will happily subscribe. If I'm in, I'm in for good :)
[ quantum sufficit / casual-tempest.net / My Combat Mechanics Thread ]

Jasonreiyn
Posts: 1
Joined: Sat Jan 28, 2017 12:15 pm

Re: Pay to Play

Postby Jasonreiyn » Sat Jan 28, 2017 12:27 pm

First off, I just found this site and I'm already really looking forward to playing. I love CoH. I played for a long time and also contributed to the message boards a fair bit. Mostly scrapper stuff.

That said my suggestion would be perhaps a setting in terms of filters. What I mean is in other MMO's I've encountered phased areas even in open world. I would suggest that those who were using the Free to play would be in 1 phase which would see the spam of the added population and people who've agreed to a monthly subscription and or have spent money on microtransactions during a window of time be in another phase. Same content but different experience for users. I would also want people in the paid tier to be able to switch if they choose (help newbie's, run with new friends etc) but that would be my idea.

Hadder
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue Jan 17, 2017 1:52 pm
Location: Toronto, Canada

Re: Pay to Play

Postby Hadder » Mon Jan 30, 2017 1:56 pm

Hi All,

Personally, I've always preferred the B2P Model (Buy to Play). Before that though, please understand that I'm not bashing any games below. I actually play those games that are listed and have been for years...

F2P (Free 2 Play)

Though, on paper (and to the frugal player) this model seems ideal, I find this model relies too heavily on micro-translations. I understand this, because it is the sole source of income for the developer, but at the same time it's often a mountain of micro-transactions for everything from expanding bank/bag space, boosters, tokens and gear looks. - See DC universe (among others)

Subscriptions

Subs have never sat well with me and I find that I overpay, over time, without any really significant additions to Sub-Based Games, especially when additions have an additional charge. When you think about it, even if you're getting a whole new continent in a game expansion, you have to add the cost of the expansion up front and the subscription that you have been paying. - See World of Warcraft Model

I know this can be interpreted differently but on average, myself and friends take a 2-3 months to finish content but then years seeking out the best gear with few significant updates during that time. Once a new expansion comes out we pay for it and continue with the sub and the cycle continues. Of course, there is the dreaded possibility that the game never gets significant expansions or updates that justify the sub either (debatable but it's how I feel)

B2P Model (Buy to Play) - My Favourite

B2P I find can still have micro-transactions but are not the exclusive means to gain money and also annoy the player/customer. This model ensures that the developer gets money upfront for the sale of the game and then you can add non-invasive micro-transactions such as boosters, very elaborate gear skins, etc. In addition, it encourages the developer to think of new, exciting and robust content to expand the game that players would also consider buying - See Guild Wars 2 Model

Thanks for reading

Hadder
Hadder


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