Character Creator question

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GladDog
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Character Creator question

Postby GladDog » Thu May 04, 2017 7:44 pm

I voted the 2nd choice. I want a good character creator, that's half the fun of these types of games! But I would rather see them release a 'very good' character creator and turn it into a 'magnificent' one once they have the income rolling in, and focus on a well made game at release.

That said, yes, eventually I want to see the best character creator EVAR!
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A1fighter
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Re: Character Creator question

Postby A1fighter » Thu May 04, 2017 9:37 pm

Agreement, otherwise I will just play DCUO. They have star power, but virtually no creator.

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Eulb
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Re: Character Creator question

Postby Eulb » Fri May 05, 2017 12:05 am

Yes the character creator i believe will evolve as we go along... good is ok right now for a start, world class will come later ..... Kept up the good work DEV's
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Re: Character Creator question

Postby Jelly_Jiggler » Fri May 05, 2017 1:57 am

If you remember, in City of Heroes a ton of the enemies' appearance was made with pieces from the character creator.

Pieces on the lost, the street gangs, the druids etc. could mostly be found in the character creator, and the Ship of Heroes guys should focus first on civilian clothes, then generic hero spandex, regular capes, flared and finned gloves, etc (the classic hero stuff) and then make stuff that can be both used for their first enemy groups as well as be put into the creator.

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JestersGhost
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Re: Character Creator question

Postby JestersGhost » Fri May 05, 2017 5:18 am

Likewise I went with the second option for the initial alpha creator. I have no doubt all the rest will follow, but morphs for my character's face are one of the last thing I'm concerned with, to be honest. I don't think I ever looked at a character's face past obvious things like tattoos, glowy eyes, etc.
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GladDog
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Re: Character Creator question

Postby GladDog » Fri May 05, 2017 6:35 am

Likewise I went with the second option for the initial alpha creator. I have no doubt all the rest will follow, but morphs for my character's face are one of the last thing I'm concerned with, to be honest. I don't think I ever looked at a character's face past obvious things like tattoos, glowy eyes, etc.
And I plan on using the CC to attract some of my old CoH buddies to the game! Once I send Feral Kat a screenie of, well, Feral Kat, I have no doubt she will be caught like a trout on a worm!
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Taivas
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Re: Character Creator question

Postby Taivas » Fri May 05, 2017 7:54 am

City of Heroes, when it was active, boasted "the greatest character creator" of any MMO. With that in mind, I think SoH has an opportunity to do exactly the same. What kept me coming back to CoH was the creation, the insane freedom of choice to make any type of character you could think of. That's the key, that's what excites superhero obsessives and draws in comic book nerds.

Make a decent character creator. You already have, I've seen the videos. Then build and build over a period of time, adding to the creator consistently. I don't see what could stop the SoH team from eventually having the monopoly on player creativity.

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Re: Character Creator question

Postby GladDog » Fri May 05, 2017 8:17 am

City of Heroes, when it was active, boasted "the greatest character creator" of any MMO. With that in mind, I think SoH has an opportunity to do exactly the same. What kept me coming back to CoH was the creation, the insane freedom of choice to make any type of character you could think of. That's the key, that's what excites superhero obsessives and draws in comic book nerds.

Make a decent character creator. You already have, I've seen the videos. Then build and build over a period of time, adding to the creator consistently. I don't see what could stop the SoH team from eventually having the monopoly on player creativity.
Their current character creator needs more choices added before it is ready to be a standalone program. This weekend I am going to start work on a few costume designs. I figure that if a dozen of us with some artistic talent can get them 6 designs within a year, they will have a lot to work with as far as costume ideas. I would like to actually get my hands on the design software, that lets you create working 3D models, but that probably requires adding licenses, i.e. more money spent. So I will settle with supplying ideas.

HGC just wants front and rear views, and you don't have to be a Marvel grade artist. Make them with the arms straight out, and the legs spread about 12 inches/ 30cm at the feet. They can cherry pick the best designs and have their art guys model them.
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Taivas
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Re: Character Creator question

Postby Taivas » Fri May 05, 2017 8:25 am

City of Heroes, when it was active, boasted "the greatest character creator" of any MMO. With that in mind, I think SoH has an opportunity to do exactly the same. What kept me coming back to CoH was the creation, the insane freedom of choice to make any type of character you could think of. That's the key, that's what excites superhero obsessives and draws in comic book nerds.

Make a decent character creator. You already have, I've seen the videos. Then build and build over a period of time, adding to the creator consistently. I don't see what could stop the SoH team from eventually having the monopoly on player creativity.
Their current character creator needs more choices added before it is ready to be a standalone program. This weekend I am going to start work on a few costume designs. I figure that if a dozen of us with some artistic talent can get them 6 designs within a year, they will have a lot to work with as far as costume ideas. I would like to actually get my hands on the design software, that lets you create working 3D models, but that probably requires adding licenses, i.e. more money spent. So I will settle with supplying ideas.

HGC just wants front and rear views, and you don't have to be a Marvel grade artist. Make them with the arms straight out, and the legs spread about 12 inches/ 30cm at the feet. They can cherry pick the best designs and have their art guys model them.
I understand that the creator is waaaay too primitive to be judged fairly at this stage. They're on the way to having something robust for the alpha testers, in my opinion.

Also, I'm sure there are lots of us who have the artistic talent to supply the team with a variety of unique costume pieces. If I were able, I'd come up with something but I haven't got any talent in the way of drawing or graphic design. I'm glad there are so many talented people in this community who are willing to give their free time to this game, yourself included.

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GladDog
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Re: Character Creator question

Postby GladDog » Fri May 05, 2017 8:37 am

I understand that the creator is waaaay too primitive to be judged fairly at this stage. They're on the way to having something robust for the alpha testers, in my opinion.

Also, I'm sure there are lots of us who have the artistic talent to supply the team with a variety of unique costume pieces. If I were able, I'd come up with something but I haven't got any talent in the way of drawing or graphic design. I'm glad there are so many talented people in this community who are willing to give their free time to this game, yourself included.
If you (or anyone for that matter) have some ideas but aren't really confident in your art abilities, send your design to me and I'll see what I can do to make it 'artsy'. I am really out of practice with precision drawing, but I love to draw so I'm willing to relearn to help out this project.

If I make and submit one of your designs I'll make sure to credit you.
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Re: Character Creator question

Postby Dying Breath » Fri May 05, 2017 11:04 am

Likewise I went with the second option for the initial alpha creator. I have no doubt all the rest will follow, but morphs for my character's face are one of the last thing I'm concerned with, to be honest. I don't think I ever looked at a character's face past obvious things like tattoos, glowy eyes, etc.
Not a designer, artist, or programmer, or anyone with knowledge about games outside of playing them. But isn't it easier to put the morphs in place first so that each costume piece (even facial pieces like glasses, beards, and hats) can be tested for clipping and other glitches? Maybe the facial morphs are less of an issue because the changes are smaller?

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broxen
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Re: Character Creator question

Postby broxen » Fri May 05, 2017 12:26 pm

I feel like these reference models may be useful for anyone looking to do rough sketches.

These are not my art, I just googled for them.

Image
Image

Also, before CoH I would use Hero Machine to come up with ideas for characters. It's a great resource for concepts.

Edit: fixed Hero Machine URL
Last edited by broxen on Sat May 06, 2017 3:36 am, edited 2 times in total.
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A1fighter
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Re: Character Creator question

Postby A1fighter » Fri May 05, 2017 12:34 pm

Valiance online wants to push the envelope
Image
You can look closely and see a humanoid horse quadrupedal second to the left. One of those dev said humanoids will not be the only body type. If anything, VO will have by far the best character creator of anyone. To my knowledge no other successor is even looking at this as an option.

It is about time we start expanding beyond the standard bipedal characters. If VO pulls this off, they will create a niche no other mmo of its' kind has. Every successor will have a character creation system which rivals CO, but they are all essentially the same. What will be different about them, nothing. It will be a accessory contest, who can implement the most accessories. VO looks to be aiming for the ultimate character generator. One of you folks said they have money, you aint lying.

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Re: Character Creator question

Postby Greyhawk » Sun May 07, 2017 2:21 am

I didn't reply to the poll. Honestly, the questions make no sense to me. Just gibberish. If Ship of Heroes is following in the footsteps of City of Heroes, than of course the most important element to have at launch is an innovative character creator! The vast majority of the passion generated in CoH players was the freedom and versatility of character creation. Not just cosmetics either. The way enhancements could be used to customize the strategic use of powers was also important. Enhance for secondary effect? Enhance for accuracy? Is recharge rate the most important quality? Minimize endurance use? Or just throw caution to the wind and go for brute power? After enhancement sets were introduced, all of these considerations became part and parcel of "character creation". For me, the strategic modification of a power was just as important as the appearance of the power.

Powergamers went insane when City of Heroes came out with Enhancement Diversification, but in my never humble opinion it was one of the best changes ever made to the core functionality of the game. It stopped dead a general trend toward overwhelming domination of brute force characters and provided incentive for a deeper, more profound strategic thinking. When Enhancement Sets came along, the trend toward strategic thinking moved forward yet another step. Careful use of Enhancements coupled with a deep understanding of each archetype's strengths and weaknesses became a rewarding path forward for anyone who had the inclination to think beyond the stage of, "Hulk smash" (while still not invalidating that basic strategy which so very many players deeply love).

So, yes, in order for me to even consider a game to be playable on any level, I have to be able to create both the look I envision in my mind and the strategy I plan out based on the available tools. I hope Ship of Heroes will feature an enhancement system at least as diverse as City of Heroes featured. For me, those two qualities are the bare minimum in playability. The reason I cannot stomach any game currently in the market is because the game designers have gone further and further away from the CoH paradigm and back down the road to the +Infinity Sword of Awesomeness coupled with the +Infinity Armor of Indestructible Defense.

I am a strategic thinker. The more viable strategic diversity the game offers me, the more entertaining it becomes. I simply cannot enjoy cookie cutter powersets, cookie cutter enhancement schemes, or any other cookie cutter approach. If the only difference between two Devastators with flame-based powersets is their costume and the color of their flames, then I'm going to become very bored, very quickly. The different strategic possibilities that emerge through modifying the relationship between the secondary and primary effect of each power was one of the most fascinating aspects of CoH for me.

Yes, I do realize I am the odd-man out. I never, ever built a character in Mids Hero Designer. It was not necessary for PvE, and I never felt the need to gain a .0001% advantage over PvP opponents. Never once. In fact, I avoided PvP for just that reason. Not that I was terrible at PvP, I did win more often than I lost, I just could not fathom the entertainment value of beating another player over the head so the minute mathematics of Min/Max thinking never appealed to me.
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GladDog
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Re: Character Creator question

Postby GladDog » Sun May 07, 2017 8:40 am

Of course HGC wants a world class character creator in this game. They are devoting substantial resources to this facet of the game. The real question is what are we willing to accept at release that will be filled out in future updates?

As far as Enhancements, they want a system like CoH, but they don't want to be sued by NCsoft (something that would likely stop the project in its tracks), so it will be different from the CoH system. How different? We don't know. But they do want something similar to CoH.

They are going to include 'gear', which is really going to be temp powers with significant and long lasting effects. Think inspirations that last for 2-5 hours, but probably don't stack. So using your healing gear will greatly increase your regen rate, but using 6 of them won't give you Instant Healing. To get a very high level of regen will require buffs from teammates.

Always temper your desire to see CoH2 with a grain of salt. NCsoft made a real statement about this by putting Stateman in MxM. They were not doing this to attract former CoH players; in fact they probably made them so angry they drove most of them off. What they were doing was putting all of the successor projects on notice; WE still own the rights to OUR game, so don't get TOO CLOSE to what WE OWN, or there WILL BE trouble.
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