UE4.16.3 Engine Upgrade

Parabola
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Re: UE4.16.3 Engine Upgrade

Postby Parabola » Fri Feb 08, 2019 5:26 pm

So what does 100 characters per server shard mean? Is that 100 players per zone instance?

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Re: UE4.16.3 Engine Upgrade

Postby Golden Ace » Fri Feb 08, 2019 5:42 pm

So what does 100 characters per server shard mean? Is that 100 players per zone instance?
Yes.
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Re: UE4.16.3 Engine Upgrade

Postby Parabola » Fri Feb 08, 2019 5:59 pm

Presumably a mission instance is considered a seperate zone from the zone it's door is located in? And do we know what limit CoH had on it's zone instances?

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Re: UE4.16.3 Engine Upgrade

Postby Golden Ace » Fri Feb 08, 2019 7:28 pm

Presumably a mission instance is considered a seperate zone from the zone it's door is located in? And do we know what limit CoH had on it's zone instances?
Correct you can enter a mission instance through Apotheosis City zone instance 1 and when you exit you could enter Apotheosis City zone instance 2 (if instance 1 is full) because entering a mission takes you out of the original Apotheosis City zone instance.

CoH I've been told had several different limits depending on the zone. I think that most city zones like Atlas Park were 100 the Hamidon zone though was 50 it was reduced several times over the years. not sure what it was originally.
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Re: UE4.16.3 Engine Upgrade

Postby GladDog » Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:25 pm

Originally CoH zone instances were all in the 200-300 range. However, that was too damn many. The zones were actually pretty small compared to other contemporary games, like Everquest or WoW, so CoH had a lot of lag issues. They reduced the size of the shards over and over. Atlas Park was originally 300 player shards, but eventually was reduced to fewer than 160. Hamidon started at 240 player shards, but was legendarily laggy. They reduced shard size over and over until it got down to the 50 person shards we played in at the end. EQ had 300 player shards, but the zones were huge, so unless there was an event, or you were in a crowded place such as a city, this was no problem. Even at that, it became enough of a problem that they reduced the shard size, although I am not sure what they ended up at.
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Re: UE4.16.3 Engine Upgrade

Postby Parabola » Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:12 am

Thanks for the info. I find the mechanics of these games fascinating. Presumably the shard limit would have to be slightly flexible to cope with odd situations? For example if I'm in a very busy zone a and i invite you to my team while you are in zone b, and need you to come to zone a to start a mission you would have to enter the same shard as me regardless of the zone being full?

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Re: UE4.16.3 Engine Upgrade

Postby Golden Ace » Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:44 am

Good question. The way they handled this in city of heroes was

you would be in shard A and your new teammate in shard B you both go to the mission door in your individual shard and you end up in the same mission even though you entered through different shards. I imagine the same thing would happen here. I’ve never heard anyone ask or speak of this before.

I do remember there being a choice to enter shards in city of heroes even though the Shard you wanted to enter was full.
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Re: UE4.16.3 Engine Upgrade

Postby lunawisp » Sat Feb 09, 2019 3:00 pm

Champions Online has a similar system. You can change to any available instance at any time as long as there's free slots. But it allows you to swap to the same instance as your teammates even if it's shown as full on the selection screen.
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Re: UE4.16.3 Engine Upgrade

Postby joshSoHDev2 » Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:11 am

The city will have a max player count for each instance and will spin up new instances once it reaches that. As others have mentioned, it is typical to allow group members to say exit running a mission instance and then go back to the same city instance, or to travel to another city instance even if over the max to make sure player groups stay together.

The "100" player limit would be per each instance, but the whole world (cluster, realm, or shard in the old definition) would hold a lot more players as there are multiple instances, then multiple mission instances holding even more players. A single instance might be limited to ~100 players, but the whole cluster could be running 100 instances with 5000-6000 players combined across all of them (for example 15 city instances and 85 mission instances).

From that point, typically you have multiple worlds. So something like US East, US West, EU, Asia etc. If each world has a hard limit (say due to the database design) you might have US East 1, US East 2, etc.

Megaserver style games pretty much work in a similar fashion, but there is no "home" world/cluster, or at least they don't advertise one. Typically they are still restricted by region (so US, EU,Asia,etc), but if desired they could put low population (say 2 AM local time) players on busier servers if they were designed to work in that fashion. Mostly it does keep populations together, and removes the need to merge servers if populations drop.

Then there is Eve Online, which runs a single game instance and everyone plays in that. They work massive battles by slowing down time between actions, so it ends up looking more like a turn based battle at the massive end of it.

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Re: UE4.16.3 Engine Upgrade

Postby Golden Ace » Mon Feb 11, 2019 11:36 am

Thanks for the update and clarification Josh.
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Re: UE4.16.3 Engine Upgrade

Postby Odee » Mon Feb 11, 2019 9:38 pm

Now that is information to get hyped about! Thanks! 🙏💝🙏
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Re: UE4.16.3 Engine Upgrade

Postby olepi » Tue Feb 12, 2019 10:11 am

An interesting twist comes into play when you try to accommodate different "states".

For example, I have already talked to X, so I can see his helper Y. My teammate however hasn't talked to X yet, and therefore Y isn't visible to him. But we are both standing together. How does the game handle that?

Or take quest eligibility. I have completed the two necessary steps to get into the quest, my teammate has done only the first step. Can we enter the quest instance? How does the game handle that?

I'd like to see generous sidekicking/mentoring, so that even if I don't have all the necessary pre-requisites for a quest, I can still go into it if teamed with someone who has. I may not get credit, but I can help. It becomes very cumbersome if we both have to be at the exact same "state" to play together.
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