Creating pets

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A1fighter
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Creating pets

Postby A1fighter » Wed Jun 20, 2018 6:36 pm

In CoT, they are holding out on the commander because it will include a feature which allows us, the player, to design our pets. This means players can customize commander pets as they do their own hero.

My question is will SoH implement a similar feature? Or do pets contain a default appearance.

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Re: Creating pets

Postby Avatar PDM » Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:31 am

In CoT, they are holding out on the commander because it will include a feature which allows us, the player, to design our pets. This means players can customize commander pets as they do their own hero.

My question is will SoH implement a similar feature? Or do pets contain a default appearance.
that would be great I love the idea of creating them individually :D

my penny to it:
elementals
clones
robots
(little) mystic beings (like you play a god and they are your pantheon for example :) )
animals
just plain people (you know like when you play some kind of Boss-Character your pets would be your security maybe ;) )
mutants ;) (just imagine having your own Hulk Army ;) )
plants
energy beings

that would be my first list of thoughts what I would like to create to a character like that without thinking it more through ;)
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Re: Creating pets

Postby Consultant » Thu Jun 21, 2018 6:02 am

I'm not fully informed on the CoT project, but I thought they had said lately that they will not be launching their Commander when their game launches. Given that they are not even including the Commander at launch, it's unlikely that the CoT team has worked out all of the details about customizing the pets, at this point.

But no, we won't let their claims of future features affect our development plans. That would be crazy. We'll evaluate the SoH pets when we get closer to having some.

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Re: Creating pets

Postby Avatar PDM » Thu Jun 21, 2018 7:12 am

I'm not fully informed on the CoT project, but I thought they had said lately that they will not be launching their Commander when their game launches. Given that they are not even including the Commander at launch, it's unlikely that the CoT team has worked out all of the details about customizing the pets, at this point.

But no, we won't let their claims of future features affect our development plans. That would be crazy. We'll evaluate the SoH pets when we get closer to having some.
so, just that I understand it right. The idea of Commanders (if we want to call them that way) is therefore not generally out of discussion - it is just not on the current schedule yet. But it is something we can eventually somewhere in the future play with that kind of class too?
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Re: Creating pets

Postby Pyrion » Thu Jun 21, 2018 9:18 am

CoT has a massive feature creep problem. They should have released years ago but even now, they don't have anything playable to show. And it doesn't look like that's changing anytime soon. All they do is showing little tidbits, promise killer features and hype the game even more, while not delivering anything.

I do wonder how long their fanbase will continue to like them. If that game would come out today with all those features i would happily test it. But i am almost sure, that won't happen in the next three years.

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Re: Creating pets

Postby indigowulf » Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:00 pm

There will definitely be commanders, if you look at the donation level "command and conquer" it's promised there, a custom pet when commanders are released. I don't think they'd make that promise as a reward and not plan on implementing it :) I think he was just saying the customization is an unknown right now.
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A1fighter
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Re: Creating pets

Postby A1fighter » Thu Jun 21, 2018 3:58 pm

Indigo summed it up

To piggyback off that, commanders are on track, but will take some time because they wish to include customization features to them. Their words, not mine. I actually had a link to the comment in one of my posts. I may have to back track way back.

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Re: Creating pets

Postby indigowulf » Mon Jul 02, 2018 10:36 am

but to add, I really really do want customizable pets :) I've always dreamed of a natural commander with animals, like wolves and bear and a swarm of birds/bugs/bats (in the format of coh mm's, the wolves would be the "3 pets" tier, the bear would be the big guy, the swarm would be a debuff power for acc or movement speed, maybe a pair of other animals for mid tier that have healing/buffing qualities.)
But really, you could make a commander power set with basic attacks- melee or ranged or magic, and then let players skin the pets with any skin/mesh that suits the attack type. Wolves for me, robots for Jack, ninjas for Jill? Why not?
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Re: Creating pets

Postby Actjcksn » Mon Jul 02, 2018 1:36 pm

I too would love to have customizable pets with a pet character creator. 8-) The major problem I foresee is the pet body types. :? In order to have the skins map properly and the power animations look good, you would need a limited number of pet body types. For the normal character creator we have 3: male, female and huge. If we have pet body types, which ones should we have? I suggest Robot, Person, Animal(maybe 3 types picked by the community), Insect, and Minion(I want a minion type with traps/force fields). That would be 2 to 3 times the amount of current body types with skins and animations. Some time may be helped by not having as many skins or power options available, but that would still take a long time. Especially if you could also customize your pet weapon and power optics. ;)
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Re: Creating pets

Postby Avatar PDM » Tue Jul 03, 2018 4:13 am

I too would love to have customizable pets with a pet character creator. 8-) The major problem I foresee is the pet body types. :? In order to have the skins map properly and the power animations look good, you would need a limited number of pet body types. For the normal character creator we have 3: male, female and huge. If we have pet body types, which ones should we have? I suggest Robot, Person, Animal(maybe 3 types picked by the community), Insect, and Minion(I want a minion type with traps/force fields). That would be 2 to 3 times the amount of current body types with skins and animations. Some time may be helped by not having as many skins or power options available, but that would still take a long time. Especially if you could also customize your pet weapon and power optics. ;)
true, that surely will be a major problem, but I believe parts of the main creation system will be usable here too. I just give my ideas as examples because I believe they are the most simple possibilites

Robots - For example if your hero is the android or robot type of character - that optic could be usable for pets too. (of course if you want more little tools that goes in the same direction as animals)
Clones - Well, you created your own character - so Clones would be ... well clones ;)
Elementals/Energy Beings - they could basically have the look of a regular character with energetic aura/optic and basically the colouring could differ here (like reddish/yellow for fire, blue/green for water etc.)
Regular People - the before-mentioned gang-boss would have creatable characters from the regular character creator too :)
Mystic Beings - my personal dream idea (creating your own pantheon ;) ) goes in the same direction as the abovementioned too

basically only plants or animals as pets would be completely new to customize. What I see as a problem though is, that if we customize our pets it would be an extra access to the "character creator" for each pet - I mean, pets do generally not look all alike after all. So, your pet would have to be sorted in classes (which have the stats which belong to the class) and for each pet you would have to reopen the character creator and then go through the creation process and safe it indivdiually.
And that would mean that a Commander is pretty complicated in question of hard drive space.
So the question might be, if there are limitations or requirements to create a Commander (maybe you have to unlock that or a Commander needs to Character Slots or something like that
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Re: Creating pets

Postby Eulb » Tue Jul 03, 2018 8:55 am

looking to have a pet ( bot ) so i can make it carry some of the heavy stuff ... ( Fallout : New Vegas )
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Re: Creating pets

Postby Avatar PDM » Tue Jul 03, 2018 8:59 am

looking to have a pet ( bot ) so i can make it carry some of the heavy stuff ... ( Fallout : New Vegas )
carry heavy stuff - you mean like you ;)?
you know that could be trouble with the robots labor union, right :)?
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Re: Creating pets

Postby Consultant » Wed Jul 04, 2018 6:48 am

So, one example for all of you. Suppose we want to create a new powerset for an animalistic pet, say werewolf powers very loosely inspired by Underworld. In that film, in the transformation of a lycan to a werewolf form, it looks like the feet change, making the ankle into a sort of second knee near the bottom of the leg, allowing the werewolf to stand upright, but sort of leaning forward, and to also run on all fours, by almost leaping forward, propelled by the feet of the hind legs.

Where will we get those animations? In that case, the actual skeleton has changed. So there is not real chance of using a MOCAP system. We don't have a lycan to wear the suit.

Answer -- we'd have to custom create the animations. Estimated time -- 6 man months. Animations are a complex business. By comparison, we could create 2-3 entire new powersets such as ranged ice blast, a gravity controller set, and perhaps a martial art set using the same amount of time and manhours.

So does it make more sense for us, right now, at this stage of development, to produce three cool new powersets for a super-human, or to produce one set of animations for a single werewolf pet class?

You can see the issue. It's not just the pet models (which would also be an issue). It's the animations. And the powers for the pets. And the coding for pets, including the controls and balancing. Pets are a huge issue, which is why we decided to put Controllers ahead of Commanders in our development (which the community requested in our polls). Pets will be (relatively) a lot easier to do once we've had regular revenues for a while and can expand the dev team. Which is probably why COH did exactly the same thing.

Now human (or robotic) pets, those would be a lot easier. :) And really ghost pets or mystic beings, the same. But things like werewolves, bears, unicorns (unicorns would use their horns as attack weapons, right? Very different than a horse) are harder, because of the skeletons and the animations.

As I've said a couple of times in the past, we are allergic to over promising. This does not mean that we don't make mistakes, we do. But when we know something's going to be very, very hard, we like to pull back and say "we're not promising that at launch."

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Re: Creating pets

Postby Avatar PDM » Wed Jul 04, 2018 7:01 am

So, one example for all of you. Suppose we want to create a new powerset for an animalistic pet, say werewolf powers very loosely inspired by Underworld. In that film, in the transformation of a lycan to a werewolf form, it looks like the feet change, making the ankle into a sort of second knee near the bottom of the leg, allowing the werewolf to stand upright, but sort of leaning forward, and to also run on all fours, by almost leaping forward, propelled by the feet of the hind legs.

Where will we get those animations? In that case, the actual skeleton has changed. So there is not real chance of using a MOCAP system. We don't have a lycan to wear the suit.

Answer -- we'd have to custom create the animations. Estimated time -- 6 man months. Animations are a complex business. By comparison, we could create 2-3 entire new powersets such as ranged ice blast, a gravity controller set, and perhaps a martial art set using the same amount of time and manhours.

So does it make more sense for us, right now, at this stage of development, to produce three cool new powersets for a super-human, or to produce one set of animations for a single werewolf pet class?

You can see the issue. It's not just the pet models (which would also be an issue). It's the animations. And the powers for the pets. And the coding for pets, including the controls and balancing. Pets are a huge issue, which is why we decided to put Controllers ahead of Commanders in our development (which the community requested in our polls). Pets will be (relatively) a lot easier to do once we've had regular revenues for a while and can expand the dev team. Which is probably why COH did exactly the same thing.

Now human (or robotic) pets, those would be a lot easier. :) And really ghost pets or mystic beings, the same. But things like werewolves, bears, unicorns (unicorns would use their horns as attack weapons, right? Very different than a horse) are harder, because of the skeletons and the animations.

As I've said a couple of times in the past, we are allergic to over promising. This does not mean that we don't make mistakes, we do. But when we know something's going to be very, very hard, we like to pull back and say "we're not promising that at launch."
first, thank you for your time for your detailed comment :)
I think everyone is aware of the fact, that it will take time and that it will be way later than the launch before those things will be possible because of the effort you explained so nicely. And I also believe that most see it my way, when I say, we appreciate, that you prefer not promising more than you can deliver but instead delivering more than you promised ;)

What (and that is the reason, why I am writing now ;) ) I don´t find in your comment, if I may ask is, if you would take into consideration, that you start a powerset and widen the variations in given time or if you want to complete everything and then put it online?
What I mean with that is, to take the current example, would you consider to start the Commander Set (as soon as you are ready to do it) with the easy ones first, publish them and go on, with the complicated ones later (like the animals or plants for example) or if you plan to have them all at once out?

And if I may ask another one - what do you think of the idea of having a story arc as the necessity to unlock your pets (any so and so many missions a new pet :roll: )
What is Reality, what a Dream? Is the dream changing your reality or is the reality defining your dreams? Only one being aware, that awareness can never be complete can use both to become the best possible and combine both to form the future! PDM

Pyrion
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Re: Creating pets

Postby Pyrion » Thu Jul 05, 2018 4:42 am

Pet ideas that are efficient from a dev time point of view, most efficient first:

1) Anything human (pirates, ninjas, soldiers, gangsters...)
2) Zombies, mummies, vampires, ghosts... can use a lot of human assets, but some minor animation work is needed.
3) Robots, drones, glowing orbs...: New models, but not much animation required. Also can probably use basic models already used by mobs, you do have some robots already.
.
.
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10) Animals, real alien aliens: Basically do everything again that has already been done for humans.


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